Curse

Dr Strangelove · Jun 01, 2008, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by [DE]

There's a difference between good and overpowered. Ursan and SY are overpowered. BHA and Prot Spirit are not.

I'd argue that they are, but elementalist bosses in hard mode are equally overpowered. You can't fix one without fixing the other.

Off Ryker's list, from a PvE standpoint:

These have massive, game breaking issues:
[Ursan]
Soul Reaping
[Ether Renewal]
perma shadow form
[Save Yourselves]
[There's Nothing to Fear]

These are imbalanced, but only slightly so. They're a little more powerful than is healthy, but don't screw things up.
[Searing Flames]
[Splinter Weapon]
[Cry of Pain]
[Great Dwarf Weapon]
["Finish Him!"]

[ss] is overpowered, but only because monster AI is retarded. The skill itself doesn't need to be changed

[pain inverter] plays off how broken elementalist bosses and the like are in PvE. In a vacuum, it's a fine skill, and with slight tweaks could be a PvP skill (cut the duration slightly). However, when matched with broken hard mode bosses, it's overpowered. Like BHA and prot spirit, the first step to fixing this is fixing ele bosses.

Abonai Laguna · Jun 01, 2008, 06:03 PM // 18:03

[skill]Smoke Trap[/skill]
Byebye everyone

The Meth · Jun 01, 2008, 06:04 PM // 18:04

About half the skills are actually overpowered. Most of the other half are just overpowered in the hands of an excellent player (which is the point of the skills). Also, things like [Spiteful Spirit] aren't overpowered, it just happens to be that in PvE everything at the hard areas has armor at the 100 level and so its all of the direct damage skills that are underpowered.

Also, nobody cares about farming, so any skills that are on the list because farmers use them shouldn't be there.

Skyy High · Jun 01, 2008, 06:24 PM // 18:24

^ You have no idea what people mean when they say "X is overpowered."

Pesi · Jun 01, 2008, 06:29 PM // 18:29

when something is overpowered- they nerf it, and something else gets overpowered.

[skill]blinding surge[/skill] eles and [skill]aegis[/skill]chains has been overpowered for a long time. Now when its nerfed, a mesmer with [skill]Strength of Honor[/skill] who buff up the frontline is really powerful because the aegis chains, and bbots are much weaker, nearly useless.

It wont stop, something will always be overpowered....

N1ghtstalker · Jun 01, 2008, 06:31 PM // 18:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightow

[broad head arrow] Kiss your casters goodbye.

that's why the arrow moves slower imo

Magikarp · Jun 01, 2008, 06:35 PM // 18:35

im sorry, but i dont understand arcing shot...

LifesRestorer · Jun 01, 2008, 06:44 PM // 18:44

wounding strike

Wild Karrde · Jun 01, 2008, 06:48 PM // 18:48

No shock to see some of the things on here.

Ursan, SY & TNTF is overpowered. In PvE its pretty much just the PvE only skills that are "overpowered". but then again who cares about "balance" in pve.

There should be two catagories. 1 Overpowered skills in PvP and 2 Skills that make everything else look useless in PvE (I said LOOK useless... Ursan isnt that great; just too dam easy for most people to not use [like most the PvE only skills] cause they dont want to think, i hate the skill but this isnt a ursan rocks/suck thread too dam many of those)

SS and Splinter Weapon is "overpowered" only for the reason Dr Strangeglove said.. AI is retarded. in reality they arent overpowered at all

Wounding strike is overpowered;instant Deepwound with a cover condition on a 3 sec recharge makes Eviscerate look like a pansy. Theres something wrong with that.

Conjure and SoH stacking is overpowered.. theres a reason brutal weapon doesnt work with enchantments. Plus its usually backing up the overpowered skill Wounding Strike.

Akolo · Jun 01, 2008, 06:52 PM // 18:52

get Searing Flames off the imbalanced list, its not even good :S
Spiteful spirit is not imba either o.O

Dante the Warlord · Jun 01, 2008, 06:54 PM // 18:54

Are you suggesting these skills be nerfed. You can't mark any PvE skills then.... comon, they are made to be overpowered, some even more powerful then elite skills. Thats why they aren't allowed in PvP because they are overpowered. Others i agree with... to a point

knoll · Jun 01, 2008, 06:56 PM // 18:56

[sunspear rebirth signet]
[resurrection signet]
[Flesh of my flesh]
[death pact signet]
[rebirth]
[renew life]
[restore life]
[resurrection chant]
[unyielding aura]

Guild Wars would be better without rezes.

Akolo · Jun 01, 2008, 06:58 PM // 18:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by knoll

Guild Wars would be better without rezes.

/offtopic mode
we actually went to fow without any rezzes , only paras /war
SPARTA WAY ftw

(made it to 7th quest XD)

LordOfTheSquids · Jun 01, 2008, 06:58 PM // 18:58

this thread is getting ridiculous. people are just posting all the GOOD skills, not overpowered ones. as someone already mentioned, just because a skill is useful does not make it overpowered.

Malice Black · Jun 01, 2008, 07:02 PM // 19:02

Over powered = PvE only skills/consumables. Normal skills used well are not over powered. End of story.

Snow Bunny · Jun 01, 2008, 07:07 PM // 19:07

D-shot and RoF are not over powered.

There is a very serious difference between something that wins you the game (like SY+TNTF) vs. something that is very nice to have, but takes skill to use (D-shot).

Chthon · Jun 01, 2008, 07:14 PM // 19:14

1. I think most of the posters in this thread fail to understand this:

Quote:

Originally Posted by [DE]

There's a difference between good and overpowered.

Dr. Strangelove gets it mostly right though.

However, I might add:

A. Soul Reaping is still butchered with an extremely awkward timer nerf that buggers up a lot of things without addressing the core problem of mechanic itself. The timer needs to be removed, AND something needs to be done about its power level. Right now, the best idea I've head so far is Carinae's plan to remove timer + remove SR from minions + drastically reduce minion costs. That removes the ability of a minion bomber hero to provide huge amounts of energy to all other necros on the team. Bye bye Sabway. (I might add that, if I had to pick just one of the two needed fixes (since a-net is awfully lazy about such things), I'd rather see the timer gone and live with the overpoweredness than the other way around.)

B. E.Renewal looks absurdly overpowered, but so far I haven't been able to leverage the infinite energy into anything truly gamebreaking. Its major shortcoming is the fact that it totally devours 2 skillslots (including the elite) and limits what you can use in several others to just sticky enchantments. That tends to leave resulting builds with a severe lack of robustness. You end up with a build that can spam 3, maybe 4, skills on the recharge, but that's all it can do; it's very one-dimensional. My latest effort on making E.Renewal useful is a E/Mo that spams PS, Shield Guardian, and Infuse. It's effective, but doesn't really perform any better in the field than my monk.

C. SY and TNTF are necessary to the game thanks to the ridiculous stat-pumping seen in HM and DoA. In the unlikely event that a-net decides to go back and take away the monsters' ridiculous stats and instead make them smarter and give them better builds, then it would be time for SY and TNTF to go. But nerfing SY/TNTF without doing something about the fundamental stat-pumping problem with the monsters at the same time would make the game worse overall instead of better.

2. This thread is a foolish idea. It's an invitation to a lazy, sloppy balance update that will do more harm than good. It's going to get a lazy, half-assed read over by a-net, and they're going to interpret it as "these are the skills we want to see nerfed" and we're going to get a whole lot of misguided nerfs hitting the wrong aspects of problematic skills, singular nerfs coming where a buff/nerf pair is needed, and nerfs to skills that are merely "good" because some idiot thought to list them as "overpowered." And those kind of nerfs are going to make things worse instead of better.

Diddy bow · Jun 01, 2008, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by LordOfTheSquids

this thread is getting ridiculous. people are just posting all the GOOD skills, not overpowered ones. as someone already mentioned, just because a skill is useful does not make it overpowered.

That was the point of my post, by peoples standards everything is overpowered in one way or another.

[skill]Wanderlust[/skill] is overpowerd because i dislike it ^^

mazza558 · Jun 01, 2008, 07:34 PM // 19:34

If some of these skills were pitted against Perma-SF, which would be beaten?

Quote:

[Ursan]

Fair enough

Quote:

Mesmer

Perma-SF beats this

Quote:

Dervs

Perma-SF nearly beats this (AoE spells get through)

Quote:

Paragons

Perma-SF beats this

Code:

[Cry of Pain]

Perma-SF beats this

Quote:

[Searing Flames]

Perma-SF beats this

Quote:

[Great Dwarf Weapon]

Would the Knockdown get through?

[Ancestors Rage]

Fair enough.

[Arcing Shot]

Perma-SF beats this

[Wounding Strike]

Perma-SF beats this

[Distracting Shot]

Perma-SF beats this

[ss]

Perma-SF beats this

[mark of pain]

Perma-SF beats this

[pain inverter]

Perma-SF beats this

["You Move Like a Dwarf!"]

Fair enough. Unstrippable Shadow Arts enchantments heal you though.

["Finish Him!"]

Perma-SF beats this

[sliver armor]

Fair enough.

[Necrosis]

Perma-SF beats this

Quote:

Sabway

Fair enough.

[skill]Keen Chop[/skill]

Perma-SF beats this

[wastrel's collapse]

What?

[broad head arrow]

Perma-SF beats this

Can you guess which skillbar is overpowered? It's funny how only a few PvE skills would be able to beat perma-SF out of this list. Knockdowns, AoE and other non-attack skills/spells are its only weakness.

Konig Des Todes · Jun 01, 2008, 07:44 PM // 19:44

I think you can remove....

Mesmer
Dervs,
Paragons (over all, on the brink of overpowered, not there yet)
Soul Reaping
[Ether Renewal] (just remove one, as you have two ER's up there)
[Cry of Pain]
[Searing Flames]
[Splinter Weapon]
[Great Dwarf Weapon]
[Ancestors Rage]
[Arcing Shot]
[Wounding Strike]
[Reversal of Fortune]
[Distracting Shot]
[ss]
[mark of pain]
[pain inverter]
[sliver armor]
[Necrosis]
[Keen Chop]
[wastrel's collapse] (I think this was a joke suggestion)
[Protective spirit]
[broad head arrow]
[Amity]

Problem with this list is that people are just naming all the good skills that become overpowered due to the "idioticness" of the AI. You can remove over half of those skills and professions/attributes. As stated, people are naming good skills, which can be overpowered depending on the other skills in the build and how it is used, but nearly every skill can and that is the point of skills. Most of the skills that were put up.

I know many will disagree but I don't really care.